Mandatory Pledge of Allegiance
is a Civil Liberties centric issue
Just a Thought
Many schools have recitations of the Pledge already. For example, at the high school I went to, Mondays always started out with announcements for that week, and then the Pledge.
I am an atheist. I do not enjoy saying "Under God." However, I do not feel pressured to believe in any god by saying the Pledge.
I think that it is a quality of being a good person to just get over certain things, and that saying "Under God" is something that reasonable people should "get over." I understand that there are people who sincerely feel that thier rights are violated by saying the Pledge. I'm just saying I don't have a problem with it.
That said, if I did choose not to say the Pledge, most people from the midwestern town I grew up in would probably understand and not force me to say it. Again, that gets back to dealing with stuff, which I feel that Missourians are pretty good at. (Unless it means not getting tickets to see Elton John at the new Sprint Center in Kansas City.)
Well, I have two problems with the pledge, personally.
I am also an atheist, so stopped reciting the pledge in second grade. The most pressure I ever received was some fairly strong encouraging from my teacher to continue saying it (which I resisted) and then the compromise that I had to at least stand with the rest of the class, which I agreed to.
Unfortunately, not everyone has it so easy. I've heard the stories of kids being ostracized by both fellow students and teachers, even acts of violence for refusing to say the pledge. As a kid, I wouldn't even have had a problem if it were not for the "under God" statement (which never should have been added to begin with) and remember, not everyone is a Christian.
The second is a more recent development, but I am finding it harder and harder to justify allegiance to a piece of cloth. I recognize that it is symbolic of the country, but people seem to be getting crazier (or I'm just more aware?) and it gives me this eerie 1984 feeling.
I see no point in legislating that schools must do the pledge of allegiance. Individual students will always have the right to opt out. Besides, doesn't our school system have more important issues? That minute saying the pledge wastes a precious moment that could have been used to teach to a standardized test. (Yes, that was sarcasm.)
Growing up in Puerto Rico, even though I am a US citizen, I didn't even hear of the Pledge, so it's very weird for me to hear the controversy over this. I think no one should be forced to say something, in any case. People (including children) should be free to say that or not. It's not like you are really, really pledging allegiance just by saying it, right?
I think we should stop reciting the pledge in all public spaces and events. If people feel the burning desire to recide the pledge, they can go home or to some private event to say it. I don't think the pledge is a ritual that has significantly contributed to the pratriotism or unity in this country. At the same time, this wouldn't be politically feasible. So athiests and apathetic Americans should probably just get over this very unimportant non-issue and draw attention back to the real problems that actually affect people- like war, deficits, social security, health care, genocide, poverty, etc, etc, etc. All of the energy spent fighting stupid, principled battles is deflected away from solving the more important problems. i would expect the athiests and nonpatriots to be more pragmatic.
I agree with several points. If people feel obliged to chant the Allegiance, they don't have to really believe in what they are saying. Everybody in my high school class recited the Allegiance with even less enthusiasm than used in Math class, and I see that as a sign that nobody really cared about what they were saying. I feel that it is also wrong for people to ostracize others for choosing not to say the Allegiance. The class that held the recital for me was Spanish class, and I just sat quietly and skimmed through the lesson plan for that day while everybody moaned on like a pack of zombies. Although some people pointed fingers, I told them to shove off, because they weren't showing any dedication to chanting enthusiastically. This was one way I found out who were my friends and who weren't - those who didn't like what I was doing and called me out were lame, while those who, no matter what their opinion, could care less what I did, were alright. Plus, the Spanish teacher didn't mind, because I was often the only person to participate in the class discussion. Mainly because I was the only one to READ the lessons.
definately a personal preference thing. starting the day in "a moment of silence" is what my high school did right after the pledge. i personally took great pride in saying the pledge but respected those who didn't wish to participate. all i ask is the same for my children (when i have some...)
Actually I think that the pledge of allegience should be something one does as a chosen action in adulthood only, I don't like the idea of someone saying, now every day you say the pledge Jimmy. Because ultimately it becomes a meaningless ritual. Pledging your alliegance should be something you do as an adult when it is a concious choice that you really mean, that's true patriotism (the ability to say, for right or wrong I will stand by your decisions and treat you as an ally) and a promise that means something. Not something you do as a child because you are told to. I mean, I still am wavering about moving to a foreign coutry some day, I couldn't in good concious make that pledge, because that means I am bound to something that is no longer my home and whose policies I might not always agree with. I see the pledge as a powerful and moving gesture if it was actually used in the way the word are meant to be used, (I wouldn't even care if people saying the pledge chose to leave out under god just because as I keep rehashing, its the pledge and not the under god that is important) and when I choose to say it I will mean it. If people treated the pledge like that then we wouldn't need a debate about pointless legislation
It is our pledge of Allegiance to the United States. It is written with every word to have meaning. "Under God" is part of it. If you claim to be a true American, then reciting the pledge should be an honor, not something to be done in passing. You may not agree with it, but it is what it is. I feel honored to recite it. And also, the only thing that brings a tear to my eye is watching Old Glory blow in the wind as the national anthem plays. It's national spirit. You maybe hold some convictions, I understand, but honor your country. It's our duty as Americans.
Thank you very much for reading!
Honda, Under God was not originally a part of the pledge and was only added during the McCarthy Era to smoke out communist sympathizers because apparently their skin boils and their eyes turn red when they say the words "Under God" not much unlike the witch from the Wizard of Oz when she comes in contact with water, or when Ann Coulter looks in the mirror.
I Believe in God, i mean I absolutely believe in him. But i find it wrong to force other people to believe in him, or say under God when they don't believe in him or don't want to. My faith is secure and i don't need my government reminding me i have faith.
Ann Coulter comment... ooo that burns me! "I'm melting!" (Oz) lol =P
I believe in God too, very steadfastly, even more so over the last few years. I walked away from a severe accident that could and should have either killed or severely injured me. The roof of the the truck crushed into the dashboard, and my head took the entire impact of the roof crushng in when the truck flipped, nearly breaking my neck. Nearly. Praise God, I walked away with only a VERY sore neck and laceration on my hand. He's the only reason I walked away.
Back to the issue, I just feel everyone should say it from a sense of patriotism, that if it's part of the pledge, don't take offense to it, but just say it for the nations sake. If one group of people is able to change it, it will happen again and again. You don't edit something like that. Know what I mean? You aren't being forced to believe in God by saying it. By the way, "under God" was actually added in the 50's, under Eisenhower, after a request by the Knights of Columbus, which is a Catholic group.
Paraphrasing a certain Rev. Docherty sermon, President Eisenhower said regarding the addition of "under God":
"These words “under God” will remind Americans that despite our great physical strength we must remain humble. They will help us to keep constantly in our minds and hearts the spiritual and moral principles which alone give dignity to man, and upon which our way of life is founded."
I think it does a good job of that, don't you?
Hondamx21 says:
"Back to the issue, I just feel everyone should say it from a sense of patriotism, that if it's part of the pledge, don't take offense to it, but just say it for the nations sake. If one group of people is able to change it, it will happen again and again. You don't edit something like that. Know what I mean? You aren't being forced to believe in God by saying it.
Problem is no one has ever been convinced to take something seriously by being forced to repeat it every day. I went to school where it was said every morning and the reason I stopped saying it was because you could litterally hear the boredom of the recitation. I wanted it to mean something, they are powerful words and so I vowed to only say it if I knew I meant it. But for most of the students I went with it was just something they had to do. Now are you telling me that legislation forcing children to do something that has no meaning to them is going to be useful or worthwhile? This isn't a debate on whether the pledge is good or not, the pledge is a wonderful thing, but legislating it so that it's mandatory, is that really something needed in law?
Hondamx21 says:
"Back to the issue, I just feel everyone should say it from a sense of patriotism, that if it's part of the pledge, don't take offense to it, but just say it for the nations sake. If one group of people is able to change it, it will happen again and again. You don't edit something like that. Know what I mean? You aren't being forced to believe in God by saying it.
Problem is no one has ever been convinced to take something seriously by being forced to repeat it every day. I went to school where it was said every morning and the reason I stopped saying it was because you could litterally hear the boredom of the recitation. I wanted it to mean something, they are powerful words and so I vowed to only say it if I knew I meant it. But for most of the students I went with it was just something they had to do. Now are you telling me that legislation forcing children to do something that has no meaning to them is going to be useful or worthwhile? This isn't a debate on whether the pledge is good or not, the pledge is a wonderful thing, but legislating it so that it's mandatory, is that really something needed in law?
Each of us has the right to say the pledge or remain silent when it's recited. Each of us has the right to decide if we believe in God and how we will honor that choice by the church we attend. Each of us has the right to refrain from Religion and deny the existence of God if we so choose.
What really bothers me more than anything is that we don't put America First. That isn't just a political slogan but if we are Americans and if we do truly love this country and for its values, principle and values we should all stand up a recite the Pledge of Allegiance together.
If you have a problem with God then stay silent on that point but don't stand outside the box because of one issue you have. This is America people, we have rights and you should never be blinded by ideology if you do support the greatest nation that we are all part of.
I haven't stood for the pledge since the 6th grade. I was ostracised for being an Atheist in addition to that. But pledging allegiance to a piece of cloth whatever the signifigance behind it is mindless. I'm not calling you mindless, but nobody should (and certainly shouldn't be forced to) pledge their allegiance to the state. I love this country, I love most of the people, the land, the trees, the rivers. What I dispise is the nationalism and patriotism that are a part of pledging allegiance. People in all countries pledge allegiance to their flags because they think their country or their god is the best, and this is dangerous.
There are plenty of hypocrites everywhere and most are clueless about it. I don't think anyone should be forced to pledge allegiance unless they are being sworn in as a new citizen, joining the military or law enforcement and when they take public office and are being sworn it to it.
When I say the pledge I mean it and have taught my children the meaning of each and every line. They say it now and my hope is when they become adults and no one is watching the still will chose to pledge their allegiance to the USA.
If that's corny then so be it.
